Do you feel like your enthusiasm for reading has gone into a downward spiral, creating an un-awesome urge to turn away from books? Don't worry - we get it! This week, Meg is joined by books and reading regular Katie Proctor who is here to help lift your spirits and show you how book-lovers can avoid the dreaded reading slump. So grab your favorite reading snack and journey with us down this literary rabbit hole of tips, tricks, and inspiration.
This is the PERFECT time to become a Super Star Awesome! Earlier this month, Super Stars Live featured a Spicy Book Show & Tell and hilarity ensued. You can catch up with the video and audio replays PLUS get access to hundreds of hours of bonus material, an exclusive Facebook group, and the texting number to reach out to the Sorta Awesome team! It’s a GREAT day to become a Super Star!
THANK YOU TO OUR SPONSORS:
*Prose: Take your FREE in-depth hair consultation and get 15% off your first order today! Go to prose.com/awesome!
*Babbel: Get up to 55% off your subscription when you go to BABBEL.com/awesome
SHOW NOTES:
Katie’s AotW: The Source of Self Regard by Toni Morrison
Inciting Joy by Ross Gay
One Day We’ll All Be Dead and None of This Will Matter by Scaachi Koul
Meg’s AotW: AD Open Door Celebrity Home Tours on YouTube
Liv Tyler’s home tour
BOOKS
The Vanderbeekers of 141st Street by Karina Yan Glaser (whole series)
Cinder by Marissa Meyer (whole Lunar Chronicles series)
Pride and Prejudice by Jane Austen
The Guernsey Literary and Potato Peel Pie Society by Mary Ann Schafer
A Prayer for Owen Meany by John Irving
The Salt Path by Raynor Winn
AUDIOBOOKS
Sign up for audiobooks.com using our link and get 3 audiobooks with a 30-day free trial!
The Song of Achilles by Madeline Miller Amazon | Audible
Broken Horses by Brandi Carlile Amazon | Audible
I Take My Coffee Black by Tyler Merritt Amazon | Audible
Project Hail Mary, Andy Weir Amazon | Audible
Lincoln in the Bardo, George Saunders Amazon | Audible
Daisy Jones and the Six, Taylor Jenkins Reid Amazon | Audible
MORE EPISODES FROM SORTA AWESOME:
Ep. 408: The books that shaped who we are
Ep. 385: Ten favorite middle grade reads
Ep. 366: Best in books & reading in 2021!
Ep. 279: The Enneagram explains your reading life
You can find Meg on Facebook, Twitter, or Instagram!
You can find Katie at her website or on Facebook and Instagram! And be sure to pre-order her latest book Color Coded!
Visit sortaawesomeshow.com for show notes on this and every episode. And don’t forget to find us in the Sorta Awesome Hangout on Facebook or @sortaawesomeshow on Instagram, and @sortaawesomepod on Twitter!
This post may contain affiliate links, which means we receive a tiny commission from the seller at no additional cost to you, if you purchase from them. We only share products and services we have used, tested, and love ourselves!
TRANSCRIPT Sorta Awesome Episode 430
SA EP 430
[00:00:00]
Meg: It's February 24th, 2023, and you know that any day that I'm joined by our books in reading regular Katie Proctor, it's gonna be a happy day for all of us. Hello Katie. Welcome back, and I am so happy to get you on the microphone again. It has been a minute, hasn't it?
Katie: It has
Katie: I'm so happy to be here today and so excited to talk to you about this because it's a topic that's so close to.
Katie: Yes.
Meg: Yes. If you didn't notice by the title of today's episode, this discussion about books and reading with Katie is gonna be a little different. Usually when Katie's here, she's got a whole book a. Usually when Katie's here, she's got a whole list of books for us to read, books that are buzzy that we wanna check out.
Meg: She fills up our T B R to Overflowing with More. Awesome. This conversation's going to be a little bit different because we're gonna be talking about [00:01:00] something that I think is so highly relatable, and that is what happens when you feel like, you know what? I love to read, but my reading is just broken. In fact, Katie, this was a topic idea.
Meg: Comes from like real life for you right now. Yeah,
Katie: a little bit. I've been in a little bit of a reading rut, but not totally, so I can't wait to talk
Meg: about all of that. Yes, reading rut, reading slump, whatever you call it, we've all experienced it and we want to first of all tell you it's totally normal. No matter how much you may love reading.
Meg: It's totally normal to go through these sort of dry spells in something that brings us so much joy. And Katie, being the reading specialist that she is, has some ideas, some approaches, some strategies. To help us feel like we can get back into our reading groove. We have so much to talk about when it comes to all of that.
Meg: We're gonna get to all of that in just a bit. I'm Meg Teets and this is sorta awesome. Welcome back. Awesomes to the show that loves to support [00:02:00] you in becoming smart, strong, and social. If you have been looking for amazing women to connect with and a community that will support you, no matter what age or stage of life you're in.
Meg: I am so thrilled to tell you that you have come to the right place. Sorta Awesome is not just a podcast, it's also your community on the go. And you know that we would love to have you connect with us outside of your podcast app in one of our communities on social media. You guys, this is where our community aspect of sort of us really happens, and it happens daily around the clock.
Meg: We have Awesomes in New Zealand. We have Awesomes in Australia. We have Awesomes all over Europe, all probably places I don't even know about. And of course across North America, wherever you are, whatever the time of day it is, you can come and find us on social media and get plugged into our community. The heart of our community is on Facebook and the Sorta awesome hangout.
Meg: We have almost [00:03:00] 6,000 women there who are there daily. To help problem solve, to give product recommendations, to give life advice, give you the feedback that you're needing in your life. And I wanna invite you to come over and join us on Instagram too. We are having so much fun with this sort of awesome account on Instagram at sort of awesome show.
Meg: Not just sharing things with you about awesome, which we love to do, but just bringing. Awesome to your Instagram feed that we know that you need. So come and find us on Facebook or Instagram. I'll have links in the show notes if you need a link to come and find us there. Katie, I know you're active in our awesome communities and truly it's.
Meg: Like most redeeming things about social media? For me, it
Katie: is, I wish that they used to have that groups part and you could not see the rest of Facebook and only the groups and I need them to bring that
Meg: back. Yes. The group app our ip, the group app, it was like the best thing about Facebook. So of course they took it away from us.
Meg: All right. [00:04:00] We do have a lot to talk about when it comes. What to do when you feel like your reading is broken. We're gonna get to that in just a few minutes, but Katie, first, let's go ahead and start this show. The way we always do with our Awesomes of the week, if you're new to awesome, of the week is the moment in the show where we stop and talk about whatever it is that's making life a little more awesome right now.
Meg: It could be a book or could be a TV show, a movie, a podcaster product, something that's bringing that gold sparkle to our days. Katie, what do you have for us
Katie: this week? Okay, so I had to bring books because it's a book episode. So we're just gonna pile on top here. Ok. Bring it on. And it's more of a book genre, and that is the essay collection, which I have fell in love with last year when I read Anne Patches these precious days.
Katie: It's just one of those things that I would never think, oh, I would like to read an essay book because usually I was into fiction or no longer non-fiction, but, Are such a sweet spot for me right now. In fact Katie Cobb, who does the currently reading pod podcast and [00:05:00] I decided that for this year we're gonna read an essay a day every single day this year.
Meg: Oh, that's ambitious. I love it.
Katie: So we had so much fun asking the currently reading bookish friends what essay collections they loved and so we may or may not have had a little bit of champagne one day and got on thrift books and ordered a whole bunch of essay collect. Two copies of each so we could each have one.
Katie: And so we have a whole stack ready to go for the year and it's no way going be so much to .
Meg: I'm obsessed with the idea of two of my favorite Katies with champagne in hand. Scrolling thrift books like yes. And just like filling their carts with all of these essays. Katie, I feel like nobody talks about how amazing essay collections.
Meg: I have shared on the show I'm a better non-fiction reader than I am fiction reader. And so memoir and like of course like your sort of self-help type books, but essays do not get enough love in the reading [00:06:00] world, I feel like. And they are. So fantastic. And you can do it in little bites like that.
Meg: You don't have to just sit down and read a collection cover to cover. You can do one a day. I'm obsessed. Yes. With your year of the essay. Okay. Tell us everything. In
Katie: fact, we have a rule that we only read one a day and sometimes if they're really long, we'll only read half a day. But I feel like essays, if you read them, if you binge 'em, like some people, I think binge essay collections, they just don't do.
Katie: Justice, I think you have to read one at a time. Take it in. Yes. Think about it for the rest of your day. And so we've been doing that. We started the year off with Tony Morrison's essay collection, which is called the Source of Self Regard. And it's like a collection of her speeches and her essays and her literary.
Katie: Criticisms and all that. She talks a lot about her own books. Tony Morrison is, was brilliant. Yes. And so most of the time both of us were like I don't understand fully what she is saying here, but yes, we got a lot out of it, especially being able to talk to each other. About the essay and what we, could get out of it.
Katie: So we finished [00:07:00] that one in January and then we switched over to Ross Gay, who wrote, who was a poet and also writes essays. And he has one, a newer one called Inciting Joy right now that we're into, and we're really loving that one. It's a little bit easier of a read. It's not so cerebral, but yes.
Katie: It's been really fun to do that. So I can't wait. We have some Barbara King solver collections. We have salmon Rushdi collection. We have another Rosk collection one from Nora Efron. So we're, we just have a whole
Meg: collection. Okay. Go. Can I give you a suggestion, like right here on the mic? Yes, please.
Meg: I Obviously you guys, it sounds like you have plenty. One of my favorite essay collections came out in 2017, and it's gonna be much more lighthearted. It definitely deals with some heavier topics, but it's written by, I wanna say I, I'm not a hundred percent sure I'm gonna pronounce her name correctly.
Meg: Sachi. Okay. And the name of it is, one Day Will All be Dead and none of this will
Katie: matter. Oh um, we have that one that was one of the thrift book purchases, so
Meg: I'm super excited about that. I can't wait to hear your thoughts when you get into that. Again, that came out in [00:08:00] 2017. I still think about essays I read in that book.
Meg: I think she's, she writes her Buzzfeed, she's a culture writer and a culture critic. But she's young and just so funny. And also there's this really poignant things in that book. I think about that years later. It's one of my favorites. Oh, good. So I can't, I'm so glad it made your list. Yes. So good. Okay. We'll put some links in the show notes if you guys do want to follow along.
Meg: Like Katie and Katie are doing this year, reading essays. Maybe you could check out a few from your library or invest in a couple of copies of these for your collection. Oh my gosh, you just made my day with the essay. Love . So great. So great. Okay. My awesome of the week. This week is very low key and very laid back because Katie, as last week my family got hit with the stomach virus of the century.
Meg: The worst was so bad. Like most stomach viruses you can count on. Some GI distress, for 12 to [00:09:00] 24 hours. This one came with all of that and fever and body aches. Oh, I just feeling miserable for like days. I'm so sorry. That's awful. Yes. So last week I was pretty low energy and somehow some way.
Meg: our Google overlords that own YouTube brought me the best gift in the form of home tours on the Architectural Digest YouTube channel. That's funny. So yeah, so I'm not like really super big into like architecture and design. That's, I love it and I appreciate it, but it's not something that I like.
Meg: That I like, consume a lot of content around I'm not one to read like a design magazine or even really watch YouTube videos that where people are, talking about different design elements. I think it's interesting, but it's not something I seek out how YouTube decided to bring this to me.
Meg: I do not know. But I am so thankful. It was just the right time. When I was just laying in bed, I couldn't, when you're sick, you [00:10:00] just want something that's just gonna barely entertain you, right? , yes. And then also you could maybe sleep through while you're, yeah.
Meg: Recuperating. So on the Architectural Digest YouTube channel, they have this whole series called Open Door, where celebrities literally open the door and say, hi, ad, welcome to my home. When I tell you it is like MTV's cribs, only grownup, classy, elevated. It is delightful. And each video is like less than 15 minutes, so you can totally, oh, just go watch one after another.
Meg: Yeah, so let me tell you, I'm gonna tell you who some of the most recent ones are so you can get a feel for what they're doing and then I'm gonna tell you the one, if you're not gonna watch any other one, the one that I think you should watch. Okay. So some of the recent ones, let's look through the list and see they've got inside Sarah Paulson's, cozy Malibu getaway.
Meg: Ooh let's see. Inside Ellen Pompeo's, mid-Century [00:11:00] Malibu beach house inside Bry Dallas. Howard's glamorous LA home inside Cena Miller's secluded country cottage. It's celebrities from a variety. Disciplines and genres and whatever. So you've got some singers, Nate Burkus in his husband's house.
Meg: You've he's not a singer obviously. He's just well known celebrity, design celebrity. You've got Tommy Hilfiger, you've got Emma Chamberlain, who's, big YouTube star. So a variety of celebrities showing off their home. I like the titles
Katie: too. , they're very Exactly.
Meg: Yes, exactly. And so what each celebrity will do is because it is Architectural Digest, they give you a history of the home.
Meg: , like when it was built. Sometimes they'll tell you like who they bought it from, what was going on with the home before they bought it. If it was something that they like, totally did a a refurbishing of, or if it was turnkey, they just bought it and they added their own touches.
Meg: Tour you through the home. They show you like the details. This is our kitchen, this is the backyard, this is the [00:12:00] bedroom. It's all fascinating if you are nosy like me and you love to see how the other people live, although this is like almost surreal how . I bet. How Dre and perfect it is. It's so great.
Meg: I'm gonna point you guys to one. If you are a woman of a certain age, like I am, I'm 40. I think you do will love to see the Home Tour from Live Tyler. Liv Tyler, actress, most famously known for playing Arwin in the Lord of the Rings series. . However, I have loved Live Tyler since 1995 when Empire Records came out.
Katie: I love Empire Records. That movie is Yes. Like a warm hug. I don't know. . Okay. Yes,
Meg: exactly. Exactly. And if you feel like Katie and I do that, I think you'll love Liv Tyler's home tour. She has this like brownstone I, I can't remember if it's like in Brooklyn or Manhattan. It's in New York City somewhere.
Meg: And she bought it when she was in her twenties. So not terribly long after Empire Records came out, when she was just like, this [00:13:00] nineties it girl with the movies. She bought it then she's lived there this whole time. Wow. She's my age. So again, she's in her mid forties.
Meg: She's had her children there. She took it down to the absolute studs and redid the whole thing. It had been broken up into several apartments. She like took all of that out, redid the whole thing. Has lived there for decades. You can tell she loves that home so much and cares about it so much. And at the time this was filmed, I think it came out in 2019, so it was pre pandemic.
Meg: Her children were quite. . And so there's like toys, like you walk in the living room, there's like a toy shelf in her kitchen. There's a little play kitchen. She where her kids play while she's like making dinner or whatever. And Liv Tyler just has this like breathy, ethereal voice as she's like ticky through the whole house.
Meg: You have to watch to the end because she has this little attic above her master bedroom on the top floor of this brown. [00:14:00] and this attic is absolutely filled with all kinds of memorabilia memories of hers. Like she pulls out a tape, a v h s tape recording of when she was on David Letterman, like in the early two thousands.
Meg: It's just love it darling. I've watched it like two or three times and it's just awesome. Thanks. Be so
Katie: happy. I love that. So anyway, and I love that she didn't clean up all her stuff and put it away for the camera. That's neat.
Meg: Awesome. Yes, exactly. I will say the toys in the video they're like neatly on a shelf, but you can tell it's absolutely the amount of toys that when the cameras aren't there, there's toys everywhere.
Meg: For sure. For sure. So I'll put a link to that one specifically in the show notes and then just to the channel and. This is not like a new series, it's just that YouTube has decided to bring it into my life and it brought me so much awesome, especially last week while I was. Sick. So sounds
Katie: like a perfect gift for you,
Meg: So I'm glad you found it. It was . It totally was. Alright, those are our awesomes of the week. Of course. We always want to hear what's awesome in your life. And speaking of our social media [00:15:00] communities on Friday, we are always asking you what's awesome. We. Often find things that we bring into our own lives here on this sort of awesome team that we learn from you.
Meg: Awesome. So please do make sure to come and tell us either on Facebook or Instagram, what is awesome in your life. I can't wait to hear all about it. Katie, we have lots to talk about with reading and what to do when we're just not feeling it. We're gonna get to all of that when we come right
Meg: okay, we are back with Katie Proctor today. You guys know that Katie is our books and reading specialist, our regular here on the show. And like I said at the top of the show, almost always when Katie is here, we're talking about what books to read at the beach this summer. Different kinds of collections that you can add to your list for whatever you're reading Mood is at the moment, but this week we wanted to do something a little bit different and just have a real life conversation.
Meg: In fact, I think Katie. This idea came to you? Back closer to the beginning of the year after Rebecca and I had been talking about how we felt in some ways the pandemic has broken us and we're still trying to get back into our [00:16:00] rhythms in our grooves. And you found that relatable. But most specifically, like in.
Meg: The realm of your life that is reading, which is a huge part of your life. Not only are you an avid reader, you're also an author. , you teach elementary and so you've got, you're thinking about topics like literacy and reading all the time. , this is like a big deal for you. Tell me a little bit more about what's been going on with that.
Katie: I will say the pandemic, like specifically in 2020 did not break my reading. In fact, it like elevated it because I was home. Okay. Yes, a lot. I think I went from like maybe 150 books in 2019 to 250 books in 2020. Wow. So that's the, just to give people context, like that's the volume of what I'm used to reading because in 2020 and 2021, I think I got up to two 40 or something in 2021 and then January came around and I got to the end of the month and I was like, I only read 10 books this month.
Katie: Which for some people is like a lot of books, but for me it just felt like I was like [00:17:00] limping toward the end of January. What is going on? I wasn't like, excited to pick up anything. I wasn't super inspired to, go get in my bed and read my book. I was doing a lot of scrolling. That kind of stuff, which happens to all of us.
Katie: So it, it made me think, let's talk about what do we do when when we're not reading and when we wanna be reading. If you're not reading and you don't wanna be reading, then do you for sure, but
Meg: Yeah, no, I think that is such a, an important thing to say is that feeling like you're in a reading slump or a reading.
Meg: Can look so different for all of us. For you reading 10 books in a month, you're looking at your list and gosh I can't believe I've read so little this month. . Whereas some people are like, I made it a goal to read 10 books last year, , if we're all on different parts of the spectrum.
Meg: I'm thinking back in times of my life because I've experienced this more than a few times. I think the first time I can really remember experiencing this would be no surprise to anyone, is after I graduated from college and I [00:18:00] had gotten a degree in English. , so it was a lot of assigned reading and writing.
Meg: Yeah. I was never reading for fun. It was always reading for. Writing about it, right? For the academic part of reading. So I had graduated with a degree in English and then I got a job teaching English. , which meant that then I was the assigner , the reading. And you had to reread
Katie: all the things that you Yes.
Katie: Pretty
Meg: read. Yes. And so again, it was still a lot of reading because obviously when you're an English teacher, you don't get to. to some extent. You have a little freedom and flexibility, but a lot of times the curriculum's set for you, especially back in the early two thousands when I was teaching, like it was pretty much you will make sure that your students read this, and this.
Meg: And again, First first of all, I had to read a lot of it for the first time. And then secondly, I wasn't reading again. It wasn't reading for pleasure. It was reading to think about how do I teach this material? How do I make this [00:19:00] fun? How do I get my students to be excited to read The Great Gatsby?
Meg: . So it wasn't like enjoyable reading. That was the first time in my life, Katie, that I was like, I don't like reading and I had been a total bookworm growing up. I was the kid I used to get in. at the dinner table for trying to, sneak books to the dinner table, trying to keep reading while we're supposed to be having family dinner.
Meg: That's cute. Yeah, like I like reading, sustained me through my childhood, my adolescence. I was always reading and this was the first time and I hear I was a young adult and I had what would be a dream job for somebody who loves to read, which. Teaching, not even teaching kids to read, like helping them engage with literature in meaningful ways.
Meg: And I just started to really. Hate reading .
Katie: Yeah, I can see how that happens. The books I read with my kids who, they're fifth graders, I can get through really fast because they're middle grade books and so they're, and they don't, I still have to think through how I'm gonna [00:20:00] teach it and stuff, but I don't think it's at that level of like high school where you have to ana break down and analyze everything. So I still feel like the books I get to read with my kids are fun for me. Yeah. And I do have a lot of freedom in what I get to pick, which is awesome. That's so great. Great. But I totally understand how all that, and we hear over and over again how ki people are just like, I like to read.
Katie: And then I went to college and had to read and then I didn't like it. So I totally understand
Meg: that. I know. And it's like such a conundrum because. I've been on both sides of it. I've been this, the college student who was slogging through American novel and had to read Moby Dick, which I think was, that probably is the moment that I was broken in reading.
Meg: I hated that novel so
Katie: much.
Meg: Just absolute slog for me getting through that. And so I understand that part of it. But then I also understand from the teaching perspective that there's a reason why. We teach books. That's the, there's a reason why literature is an important part of a well-rounded [00:21:00] education and like, how do we balance the two?
Meg: It's, it really is quite the conundrum. My I've thought about it a lot. I'm sure all teachers have in some way. The other times, I can remember really hitting a dry spell is after my first child was born. And I was just, you would think, cuz you're spending, and I was a stay-at-home mom, I had a brand new baby and you would think that would be such a great time for reading because you're like at home a lot.
Meg: It's hard to get out of the house. Daisy was born in January, so I wasn't out and about very much when she was a new baby. And I can just remember just your brain is just so overtaxed. Yeah. Yeah, I had no capacity for reading
Katie: in those days. I will say my postpartum days, I read a lot in the middle of the night for like night feedings.
Katie: I would have my kind up on my phone and so I would read for that. But during the day, like all I wanted to do was like watch criminal minds on repeat on some weird cable channel and not even think about anything.
Meg: Right. Totally get that too. And I [00:22:00] feel like a little old now because I'm thinking like 2005, when Dixie was born, we didn't have e-readers.
Meg: Were reading. , a paper book that you had to keep track of and find your place and whatever. Or you weren't reading, , right? . If you were listening to a book, it was like literally a book on tape
Katie: that you checked out at the library. , you had to have your Walkman next to
Meg: you a bed. Yes.
Meg: Yes. And so there wasn't a lot of flexibility back in those days when I was a brand new mom. I'm trying to think of other times. I think speaking of postpartum, I have said this for years. One of the reasons why I love Rainbow RA's book Fangirl so much is that is the first book that I read coming out of postpartum depression after our twins were born. Like I, when I had postpartum depression, like I was definitely not reading, but it was like reading that book was the first time I can remember feeling just joy. Just for the like [00:23:00] intrinsic experience of joy. And I always marked this when I got to meet Rainbow at a book event years ago, I wrote, A card and gave it to her at, because she did a meet and greet book signing afterwards and I gave her a card and and I put my Twitter handle in there cuz she was used Twitter a lot back in those days.
Meg: Maybe she still does. I don't . But anyway, I left my Twitter handle and she sent me a message to say thank you for the card. That was so lovely. But I told her like that's like fan girl means so much to me cuz it was like such a huge like mile marker in my recovery. So anyway, I love that. And then last year was tough with me for reading because I had started out the year like so Gungho and so just, I was gonna do all this reading, journaling, like I got super into book talk on TikTok and there was all these books and. Book journals and I was so excited. And then when my mom died in March, I just was like, everything I had been doing leading up to that, like I just, I couldn't even, I couldn't physically even pick up my book journal because it just [00:24:00] was so closely attached to the weeks before my mom passed away.
Meg: Yeah. And then I just kind was like, I don't know. I will say thank goodness for audiobooks because for some reason I felt. So much freedom and just I didn't have the same attachment as reading a physical book, which was really difficult for me. But listening to a book, I could totally. and that's how I basically do like almost all of my reading now.
Meg: I
Katie: do a big chunk of my reading on audio. And I think it's because I feel, and this may be off topic a little bit, but I feel like a little bit guilty that I'm not up doing something. If I'm sitting down reading a book, which I should not feel that way because we should have times to sit down.
Katie: But audio books let you do all the things at the same time. Yeah. . And so I do a lot, I do a lot of reading on audio these days too.
Meg: I feel like that's some big three energy coming through. , it's . That reminds me, I just saw TikTok this very morning. I saw TikTok with the woman who was talking about what it's like to be married to an [00:25:00] Enneagram three.
Meg: And her wife had gotten a walking pad. I guess you can buy, it's kinda like a treadmill, but there's no like candle bars for your desk, like you just walk. She bought it for their living room so that she could walk while they watch Gilbert Girl Rereads. Oh, in the evening . And she was just talking about like that three thing that like every single minute has to be productive.
Katie: .
Katie: Yep. It feels of gross, but it's a thing.
Meg: I got such a kick out of that. I had to send it to Kate Annia, who's been on the show a few times. She's my daily yoga partner. So I had to send her to that, send that to her because she's also A three and she's I've thought about getting rid of that
Meg: That's awesome. But yes. Anyway, to go back to the audio book thing, it does, it like lets you read while you're going about your daily life, whether you are walking the dog or doing the dishes or folding the laundry it brings reading into your day. in a way that sitting with a physical book can't always happen.
Meg: . And so I'm so
Katie: thankful for that. Me too. And I love [00:26:00] how easy they are now you don't have to have, you just have to have a phone and some earbuds and you're all set. Yes,
Meg: exactly. Exactly. But you have some ideas, we're gonna get to that in a second. But are there other times in your life I feel like I've been just chit-chatting away about my own reading broken times that are there other times in your life when you've been like, I am in a deep rep, whatever that looks like for you.
Katie: My, I feel like mine goes more in cycles especially with the school year now that I'm teaching again we have report cards season and it's like we have to write all these report cards and so I don't get a lot done in that, those weeks leading up to that or right at the beginning of the school year when you're just so tired, , I come home and go to sleep at eight 30 and there's not a lot of time for anything then, so mine, mine just like ebbs and flows.
Katie: What my kids are doing and with school. And so that's, I think that's what happened to me in January. Like I took this break. I don't think I did a single thing for school over the Yeah, the Christmas break and I was like so refreshed and then I came back to work and I was like, oh, we have things to do now[00:27:00]
Katie: So yes. That is ki probably why my reading was lower in January.
Meg: Yeah, no, that totally makes sense. And I'm just curious, I don't know if we've ever talked about this, what percentage, just like roughly guesstimate, what percentage of the books that you read in a month are you actually reading for, to prepare something for your class?
Meg: Is it connected to school? I had never really thought about that, but you probably are, especially cuz you love middle grade and incorporate a lot of that into your classroom. Do you find your reading. Like a quarter of your reading list for a month might be stuff that you're gonna actually have in your classroom.
Meg: Okay. So you're
Katie: gonna laugh cuz this is three energy too, but I don't actually count the books that I read for class for my personal
Meg: books. Cause
Katie: Yes, because they're ones that I've read before. And so really like on my, second or third time through I'm mostly either skimming or listening really fast on audio just to make sure.
Katie: Got it. Have the story and I can go into class and can talk to them about the things. So I don't necessarily count those unless it's a first read, but I don't usually do [00:28:00] that with my students cuz doing a first read with them is scary if you dunno what's happening. for sure. Yeah. But I will say I do a 40 book challenge in my classroom with the kids.
Katie: So I, I issue them a challenge at the beginning of August and say, Hey, let's read 40 books together. And so they're reading on their own. I'm reading on my own and I. I, most of my middle grade books that I read count towards that for my personal challenge with my kids like that. Okay.
Katie: Okay. So I have like different genre requirements and stuff, so I'll be like, oh, I need a historical fiction, and the kids will like, read this one and I'll go read that one. So those I do count for my personal books. Got it. Because those are usually new to me. Though love, I would say about 25% probably each month or middle grade.
Katie: Okay. And I read those just to keep up with my kids in the classroom so I can talk to them about what they're reading and things like that.
Meg: Yes, I love it. Every single time you talk about how much reading you incorporate into your classroom, I just, it makes me so happy, so inspiring. So good. Okay. Like I said, Katie has some ideas about like, why do we get into these reading rods?
Meg: And also [00:29:00] if you push play on this episode, thinking okay, my reading is broken right now too. She's got some tips for you. But you know what, maybe you're not there right now. But again, we all hit these moments. We all get into these like you said, into these cycles where you just are not feeling it.
Meg: So even if you're not there right now, Either, save these tips for the future or pass us along to somebody who has mentioned to you that's, I just don't feel like reading anymore. So Katie's gonna help us bring the awesome back to our reading lives when we come right back.
Meg: Okay, we are back and we are talking with Katie Proctor today about what to do when your reading life feels broken. When you have hid that reading rut and just no matter what, you just can't find that motivation to pick up a new book.
Meg: Something that we didn't even, maybe you're gonna talk about this. Maybe you like finished a great book and you like, are like I, I can't imagine reading another book right now. Maybe that's on your list. You've got some ideas about why does this happen to [00:30:00] us. First of all, before we talk about how to try to fix it.
Katie: Yeah. Book hangovers are for sure a real thing. . Yes. And one of the ways that I make sure I don't get stuck into book hang hangover is make sure that I have the next one picked out already. Ooh, that's smart. And lots of times I will even put down a book, even if I loved it. I will put it down and read the first chapter of whatever book is next, like right away.
Katie: That's so smart. I won't even take. Because sometimes you can take a few days and just be like, oh, I love that book so much. Yes. Don't have anything else, but if you go ahead and pick up the next one, that's something that I do. And like we talked about before, sometimes you just wanna watch TV instead.
Katie: Sometimes your brain is not ready to consume books. Sometimes you're just too tired. . Oftentimes I get stuck behind a book that I feel like I should be reading because, , whether like everyone else is reading it or it should be a good fit for me or something that I was like super excited about, so I made sure to buy it.
Katie: So I feel some kind of obligation to it. But I'm just not loving it. And so that'll sit on my nightstand for a while and I look at it and I'm like, [00:31:00] I don't wanna read that , so I'll go do something else.
Meg: Yes. So things like that, I think sometimes. Sometimes, if you're in a book club and it was somebody else's selection. But you feel like you said, that obligation thing. Like I really should be reading that. I think sometimes it might like trigger like our school days when it feels like assigned reading. Yes. Yes. In, and then it's hard to find the motivation when somebody else told you, oh, you gotta read.
Katie: Yeah, absolutely. So there's all kinds of reasons we, get stuck, but there's lots of great ways to
Meg: get unstuck, . Okay. Let's talk about that. What are some ideas that you have that you have for us awesomes especially that you've found to be true in your own life? Like, how do we. Unstick ourselves.
Katie: So my first and biggest suggestion to anyone is to find a middle grade or a young adult that is not gonna require too much attention or focus or, brain power for the vocabulary level and all of that. And just to sink into. Like a fun quick [00:32:00] read that you can, especially if you're in Enneagram three and you care about your numbers, get through it quickly.
Katie: Yeah. And enjoy it. But I have two series that I wanted to bring today that I don't think I've talked about on sorta awesome before, but the middle grade series that I love and series are great because if you love the first one, you can hop onto the second one and go and go until you're all out.
Katie: And that those can be so fun to just, get into and For middle grade, the Vander Bakkers of 140, 41st, sorry,
Meg: can I redo this that time? Yeah, you can take it. The Vander Beakers
Katie: of hundred and 41st Street by Karina Jan Glazer. This is a middle grade curmudgeon story, so if you love like a man called UVA or any of, or Eleanor Oliphant or any of those, this is about a family.
Katie: that lives in Harlem and they're there's five kids. It's a very chaotic household. They have all kinds of animals. And they find out that their landlord, who lives on the third floor is actually not gonna renew their lease. So he has made it clear that they are too much, too [00:33:00] noisy. One of the girls plays violin and so she's, constantly playing music.
Katie: They are just, Like such a lovable family, but they're a lot and he is a recluse and they don't know much about him. So throughout the course of the story, the kids are like on a mission to save their house cuz they love their house. And so they're trying to find ways to convince him to let them stay, to learn more about him and his story.
Katie: And this is one that I read with my kids every. Inevitably they wanna go and find the next one right away
Meg: oh, I love it. I was gonna say, this sounds like a great read aloud for sure. Yeah, too. It's great. And we do have kids.
Katie: Yes. And it's so far, there are six of them, and I think she's writing a seventh, and that'll be the last one in the series.
Katie: Oh, there's lots you could get into. Now my mom, who is, In her seventies, loves the Vander beaker. She is do you have the next one? Do you have the next one? And it's just a great series to just feel really good about. So that's the middle grade one, the young adult one, which is older.
Katie: And so all the way done is called the Lunar Chronicles by Marissa Meyer. Have you read these? I have
Meg: starting with them. [00:34:00]
Katie: Yes. Starting with cinder. So this is yes. Futuristic. There's cyborg. Cinder herself is a cyborg. It's a retelling of Cinderella. She gets commissioned by this prince to fix this robot thing that he needs, and they fall into this huge rebellion thing that's going on.
Katie: . So it's like dystopian, but it's like fairy tales. And there's a romance, but it's not, it's like really sweet and innocent. Yes. And I think there are four of those with some noves sprinkled in. And I just love those. I read them straight through and that was. . Just
Meg: such a joy. So yes, series
Katie: and for Kids
Meg: series are great.
Meg: I will say that, that cinder series, I call it the CDER series. I don't know if that's what, I don't think it's meant to be called that, but that's how it is in my mind. Starts with Yes, exactly. Those are so fast. So fast paced. , like you can, you get right into the action right away. Yeah. And I think that really helps you to just, you just wanna keep going.
Meg: I love that series. I haven't thought about in a while, so good. Yes.
Katie: [00:35:00] Love that. So the next thing that I always say too is to find a book that you have loved. And just reread it, like for you, I'd be like, go back and read fan girl. Go back and read. Yes. Those books that just make you feel like it's a warm hook, , yes. Because you don't, when you're getting into a reread, you know what you're getting into, you know where the story's gonna go, you know what you're gonna feel like afterwards. And so that can be a really comforting place to just dip into.
Meg: Yeah. Yeah, I think sometimes we like don't give ourselves permission like we think if we've read a book as much as we loved it, like we just gotta keep it on the shelf, like it's like cheating or something.
Meg: If we reread a favorite it's book. It's not cheating. It's not
Katie: cheating. It's not cheating. No, it's actually wonderful. And one, pride and Prejudice is a book that I reread often and I actually have it on my Kindle app on my phone. So if I find myself without a book somewhere and I need to wait a little while, I can open that up and just wherever I am in Pride and p.
Katie: I could just keep going. Yeah. Because it's one of those that I [00:36:00] love. The Goey Literary and Potato Peel Pie Society is another one that I've read multiple times. . Cause it's just, it's a epistolary and you can read a couple of letters at a time and just dip it back and. Into it. So that's another one that I love.
Katie: And a prayer for Owen Mimi is, my favorite of all times. And so getting to reread that sometimes is just oh, I love this so much. And you remember why you love to
Meg: meet when you read your rereads. That is the perfect way to say it. If you're if you're. in a reading rep because you're just, you feel disconnected from that.
Meg: Just sheer joy of reading. , I think that's a brilliant idea. Pick up a book that brought you joy. And reread it. Remember why it's so fun. Yes. Of course, you might remember the big picture of what's gonna happen, but there's gonna be like those little words and phrases and moments that you're like, oh my gosh, I forgot about this.
Meg: And you , you get to experience and relive those feelings that you. For that book and those characters and everything that happens all over again. That's fantastic.
Katie: [00:37:00] Yes. Yeah. Another thing that I love to do is just go get a new book. Go to the library. Go to your favorite indie bookstore, even if you don't get anything.
Katie: Just like being surrounded by books. Yes. And smelling them and hearing other people talk about books and seeing other people be excited about books can be a really fun way to get yourself back. Mindset of I want to read and I wanna feel like I wanna read. And that's, those are two places to go to do that.
Katie: Yes,
Meg: absolutely. Do you have anything that you've picked up recently that you're like,
Katie: people lots of times, this is my favorite thing too. Lots of times librarians will have like staff picks or or in new releases or, little shelves and indie bookstores often have staff picks.
Katie: So they have what we call shelf talkers or something. . I usually, again, this is like a lot about my engram threeness, but lots of times when I go to a bookstore, I have a list of books that I wanna get, right? Like I already know what I'm gonna go in and look for, but sometimes I like to be surprised.
Katie: And so the last time that I [00:38:00] picked up a book that I was, had no idea was not on my radar at all was when I was in Waco. We went to f. Oh yeah. And they had a memoir on the shelf and some staff member had written that they loved it. And it's called The Salt Path by Rainer Wyn. I don't know if you've heard of this one.
Katie: I have not. and it's, I, at the time we were like considering going off grid and like living in an RV full-time. . Yeah. And yeah, doing the thing. And so I was like into those adventure books like Tish Oxen writer and her family had gone, to travel the world around the world. And Yes. And so this one was in that vein.
Katie: And so this one's about her their elderly couple, her husband discovers that he has a terminal illness of some kind. They lose their entire. Property, some weird, like shady business deal. They lose their farm. Their grown kids are off on their own, and so it's just the two of them. And so they decide to, liquidate everything.
Katie: And go walk this 630 mile salt, the, it's called the Southwest coast path in England. And so you get to [00:39:00] see them prepare for this, you get to see them live through it. They're like backpacking and living in a tent and, People that they meet along the way. And so it's one of those adventure stories.
Katie: But I loved it so much and I would've never picked it up had I not seen it at the bookstore. Yes. Yes. I've just been like, oh,
Meg: this one looks really good. Yeah. So I think that's such good advice. Go somewhere where the. . The vibrations around reading are really high. Like you said, could be your local library.
Meg: , most of us have access, at least to a local library. Could be a local bookstore, even if you can't get into a physical location. I feel like the digital equivalent is listen to a Books and Reading podcast. Of course we would recommend currently Reading or Amy Ellen Clark's book gang podcasts or two that we love around here, but there's so many.
Meg: . . A lot of times just hearing that energy, that enthusiasm that other people have for reading. Can relight your fire a little bit. Yes. If not, if [00:40:00] nothing else then give you like these hooks for oh my gosh, that sounds like something I would totally love. I find the same energy on book talk.
Meg: I really do. Book talk has. Come through, like a lot of like random criticism, I feel like from like more mainstream media articles in the past couple of months. People saying oh, book talk just recommends the same 20 books over and over. I guess it depends on what book, what TikTok is showing you because have come across books on TikTok, people recommending 'em that I never would've found, I had never heard of, never would've found. But the person, the Tucker who was talking about the book was like so enthusiastic about it and just presented it and just the right way there. I was like obviously you have to read that , I love that.
Meg: Yeah. But just, yeah, finding somewhere where the energy around books and reading. Is high because I do think that sometimes when you're in a reading rut, you tend to avoid reading centric things. You tend to avoid going to bookstores cuz you feel bad about reading. Where you feel guilty that you're not reading [00:41:00] and so you avoid the thing that could actually help you get that spark going to where you wanna pick up a book.
Meg: And truly, if you have an independent bookstore and libraries do this too, like people who love books, they're gonna be able to pretty quickly tell you like if nothing else, you should at least pick up blah, blah, blah, blah, and get you hyped up about it. Yeah. So yeah's
Katie: creative, and you can borrow people's enthusiasm sometimes if you're not feeling that enthusiasm.
Meg: Yes. So yes, exactly.
Katie: Exactly. . Okay. We talked about audiobooks already, but I just can't say enough. There's so many benefits to just being able to throw in your earbuds to listen to something, whatever it may be. While you're cleaning or doing laundry or working out whatever. I feel like I didn't really listen to audiobooks too much
Meg: until.
Katie: like the past couple of years, I think I got into them. But I feel like the quality of audiobooks has gone way up in the production. And because I've listened to some older ones, like I'll go back into a back list of mystery series or something, and I'm like, oh, [00:42:00] audio is not as good here. And so they've been doing really creative things with audiobooks, like full casts when there's, different perspectives shown.
Katie: The different ways that like people weave music into them now or you know, different production quality. And so I wanted to bring some of my favorite audiobook
Meg: experiences. Yes, let's hear it. So the
Katie: Song of Achilles by Madeline Miller. It. Is one of the best audio books I've ever read. His, the narrator's voice is just like a butter.
Katie: It's about the Trojan War. Told from the perspective of Patrick Lis, who is Achilles in this story, his lover . And it is just a beautiful, tragic. We all know how it ends for everybody, but it's gorgeous. Yeah. And the audio is so good. and then broken horses by Brandy Carlisle, which I just boss people around all the time to read on audio because at the end of every chapter is a song that she sings you.
Katie: And so it's beautiful. Yep. And then I take My Coffee Black by Tyler Merrit, which I talked about, I think last night with you. , [00:43:00] just, he left all these. All these sweet moments where he like breaks down and cries and his producer's do you need a minute? And he's no, I think I got it.
Katie: And just to see that whole process work out for him on the audiobook is tremendous. So those are my three go-to recommendations
Meg: for audiobooks. You know that when we talk about if you want an audiobook experience, I'm going to say Project Hail Mary. Oh yeah. , which Andy Weir wrote that.
Meg: Was that during the Pandemic ?
Katie: I literally can't remember when that came out. Yeah. Yeah. I think it was, I got it right when I moved to Albuquerque. Yeah. Okay.
Meg: That audiobook experience is a phenomenal, so great. I love it so much. There's so many audiobooks I love, but I feel you mentioned the full cast approach.
Meg: To recording. Have you ever listened to? Lincoln and The Bardo.
Katie: Okay. No, by George Fond. I tried that one and it was so weird. I
Meg: was it's weird. Confus. It's [00:44:00] give it like, like a conceptual novel. Is that what that's called? Like speculative fiction? Speculative fiction. . I think that's what it is.
Meg: It is very strange. It is a strange story, but the audio production is 166 people in the cast. It's like this idea of Lincoln President Lincoln being I, is he like in a cemetery? I haven't listened to it, but I, it's one of those that I feel. Someday I'm gonna tackle this. Someday I'm gonna get to this.
Meg: But he's like interacting with all of these spirits. And the cast includes people like Nick Offerman and Megan Molay are in it. Rain Wilson. Oh, keegan, Michael Key Miranda July. Carrie Brownstein, like they're Susan Sarandon, like the cast is freaking incredible. And for that reason alone, I'm always like, you know what?
Meg: I'm gonna spend one of my audible credits on that. I'm going to get to it. I just, Really had the motivation to actually get it in, push play on it. But I've heard like it's a, it is a whole experience for sure. Okay,
Katie: [00:45:00] I have not heard that and so I'm intrigued now. Maybe I will give another try.
Katie: I think I tried to read it on Kindle and I was like, what is actually happening?
Meg: I have no, yes. Yeah. Another great one is Taylor Jenkins reads Daisy Jones, I six. Oh. Uhhuh. is a full cast. Recording and that one is fantastic. And also they're coming out with the TV series of that. I don't know if you saw trailers on that.
Meg: It did. Looks it's gonna be, looks. I love
Katie: that book, but I read it on paper, which I guess is the wrong way to do that, but I
Meg: still look. It's really good on audio. For sure. There's so many good ones. Like we don't wanna turn this into a whole audiobook episode, but there's so much good stuff out there, and truly it is a great way to get back into reading because you can just work it back into your life.
Meg: Like sometimes you just feel like I'm in a reading, right? Because when on earth am I gonna sit down with? Like my schedule does not allow for this. If I sit down, I will fall asleep. That's literally why I started reading books on audio because I was in a stage of life where I was just so rung out [00:46:00] that , anytime I sat down with a book, I would genuinely fall asleep.
Meg: I can work audio into my daily life and it works for me. Yeah.
Katie: Yeah. Okay. I have one more suggestion and then this one is just to read with a friend. It's always just to have some accountability and to have a social aspect to it, to, because sometimes you just wanna be able to talk to people about what you're reading and sometimes you don't.
Katie: Either of those things are fine, but I find that having a buddy to read with, or even just a, even if you're not reading the same book, but if you're like, Hey, what are you reading right now? Yes, this is what I'm reading and this is what it's about and I really like it. Have you read this one? Just having those conversations, which I feel like I get to do all day because I get to have those conversations with kids.
Katie: I get to have them with my librarian at school and Katie and I read a lot of the same books together. or we read them like at different times and can talk about them. And so that's really fun. But there's just not a lot of rules with buddy reading. You pick a book that you wanna read together, decide on a schedule or not, sometimes. . Like for this essay thing that we're [00:47:00] doing, we read an essay every day, but if we pick like a fiction book to read, it's just like balls to the wall. Whoever can get the end first will be waiting for the other person to finish. And. We do things differently. And then just to talk about 'em frequently Hey, did you get to this part yet?
Katie: Or, where are you? I don't wanna spoil something, but I'm excited to hear what you think about X, Y, Z. Yeah, I wanna tell you, I don't know if you've heard about the Fable app, Meg. , have you heard
Meg: about this app? I have heard about it. I've not used it. I think I heard about it in the currently reading podcast group.
Meg: Yeah.
Katie: So I need all of the awesomes to know about this. Okay, let's hear everything. So the Fable app gives you a way to have a book club or even just with two people. You. Tell 'em a book you're reading. It's free app. Unless you wanna have a million people on there, which I think you have to have a paid upgrade thing, but I have a free one.
Katie: And so you tell 'em what book you're reading and it loads all of the chapters into the app. So if my essay book that we're reading now has 10, 10 or 14 essays, and so each one has its little thing . So you can go in to whatever part [00:48:00] you're at and you can click on the chapter that you're on.
Katie: And. Put your thoughts in there, and so then your friend who's reading with you can come back later and be like, oh, hey. And they can respond. They can leave you a little emoji. They can see it. And then that way you're not spoiling anything, especially if you're reading fiction, right? Because if you just go to the chapter that you're on, then you can say something and then you don't have to go further.
Katie: And so yes, you can keep track of where you are. You can keep track of your. We're using it as a, we're gonna archive all of them and then be able to go back. We like put quotes that we love in there. I wanna remember this line forever, so I'm typing it in here, you it's just a nice way to collect those thoughts about those books.
Meg: So it's really cool.
Katie: Brilliant. Yeah, it's great. And so that's what Katie and I have been using for our buddy reads is that app which lets us have our chat, our normal like chat doesn't have right dates about those books, and so it lets us keep it separate, which has been really cool for us.
Meg: my gosh, that is so [00:49:00] smart. I'm so glad. The internet in the app world exists because this has been needing to be a thing for so long. I love it.
Katie: All right. So I wanna tell you about just the two, two of the most recent ones we did together that we both loved. The first one's called Invisible Child Poverty, survival, and Hope in an American City by Andrea Elliot.
Katie: Have you heard of this one? I have, yes. So this one is, it's tough. It's nonfiction. It's almost 500 pages. She's a New York Times investigative reporter. She, her goal going into this book was to expose what was happening in one of the family shelters in New York City. For homeless families and sh what she found was this one family that she fell in love with them.
Katie: Yeah. And especially the oldest daughter, her name's Dasani, and she basically followed her from, by the time she was eight all the way until she was in high school. And this reporter's been around for all of their ups and downs and all the things that they have to go through all, and she's documenting how, how they [00:50:00] survive, how they, have to get to school and how they can feed their family and how all of these things happen.
Katie: And so it's a really it's tough, but it's a really good look at our systems and how people are having to navigate systems and live through systems. And you just, you. Her and you just fall in love with this family and especially Dasani. So that was one that we read together and we read that one pretty slowly.
Katie: I think we did one or two chapters a day. Yeah. Just to get to, to have a little bit every day. And then the most recent fiction one that we love was actually a book of the month pick and it was called Black Cake. Have you read that one
Meg: yet? No, I've seen the, I've seen the cover is really?
Meg: Yeah. Gorgeous. So I've seen it all over. It is the place I haven't read it.
Katie: It is. So this one's by Charmaine Wilkerson, and it's about these brother and sister Benny and Byron and their mom has just passed and they have been pretty estranged. And so they, they both get called by the lawyer and he has them listen to this eight hour recording that their mom put together for them.
Katie: Oh, wow. And they have to get through it before the [00:51:00] funeral, but she. Secret that she has been holding her entirely. Ooh. And is now just now telling her kids about what actually happened to her as a kid and how she got to where she is and who their dad was and all of these things. And we get to go back in time to see her life, and then we get to be in the present time with the siblings as they wrestle with all of this.
Katie: Wow. What I loved about Black Cake, first of all, was the chapters are like three pages long. Oh, wow. Wow. A hundred percent on. For short chapters, they're my favorite. Yeah. Really easy to keep flipping and I just felt like the ongoing mystery and the family component was just like catnet for me.
Katie: So those are the last two, the most recent ones that we've done, that we have loved. And I wanted to bring them so everybody knew about them. .
Meg: Yeah, you never know. I feel inspired to pick that one up because that sounds fascinating. So yes, I'm so glad you brought such good examples for us. So if we do need a little spark to relight the reading of fire to of help fix, any ruts that we have found ourselves [00:52:00] in.
Meg: Those are such great suggestions. Katie, thank you so much. You are welcome. Okay I think that this is gonna be a really helpful and. I think this is gonna be a really helpful conversation for people who are feeling a little broken, a little stuck. It's not something that we really talk about a lot.
Meg: I think especially if you are a pretty avid reader, it can, you can have a lot of feelings around it. or if you're listening and you're like, I used to like to read years ago. Maybe I could get back into it. Wherever you are on the spectrum, I hope that this has spoken to you. And again, pass this on to somebody in your life who maybe has mentioned that they're struggling with their reading lives because I know people are gonna be able to find the awesome and get that back into their lives.
Meg: Katie, if people wanna find you all around the web to follow along with what you're doing, you share so much about great books and reading on your social media, where can we find you doing that?
Katie: Mostly on Instagram at k Proctor Writes and Reeds.
Meg: Yes. [00:53:00] Okay, you can find me on social media at sorta awesome Meg, where whatever platform you're on, just search for me There you can find sorta awesome wherever you are by searching sorta awesome.
Meg: Again, we're on Instagram at sorta awesome show and the Hangout is sorta awesome hangout on Facebook. We would love to have you join us. We love to hear your feedback on this show. So come and find us anytime and let us know your thoughts. Katie, thank you again so much for all of this. This has been. I totally make my day just hearing you talk about it, so thank
Katie: you.
Katie: Thanks for having me again. I love doing this with you.
Meg: Awesome. Thanks so much for listening. We'll see y'all next time. Okay. I'm gonna hit stop on.